Civic Bridgers founder, Libby Stegger, and students, Angelina Rueda and Sumaya Yassin, share stories about bridging across Minnesota's rural, urban, and suburban communities
We might disagree deeply on many things, but we can agree on the value of pluralism. But if we choose not to bridge consistently, we will continue to be in a space of lack of understanding. And so we don't have a choice in some ways. We're all here and we're not going anywhere. And so in order for us to address those power imbalances and to really hear each other deeply and to actually make changes that will be good for everyone, we actually have to find ways to bridge.
Angelina Rueda:I think bridging is a way to get power back. Growing up in this era of polarization where as Hispanic women, felt like a lot of my personal character was being attacked by people I did not know and I do not know. So it's been really awesome to able to sit down and really understand where is that coming from? Why is that here? And how can I make sure that my story is heard?
Sumaya Yassin:I joined Civic Bridgers because I had my own assumptions of what a rural area would be like, which weren't the most positive assumptions. And then we come together and we're slowly starting to see eye to eye and start seeing each other as people. It breaks down these barriers of, oh, we aren't so different. Both communities have these core values where it's desire for safety, belonging and opportunity. Everyone has their differences again, but we still have that need.
Ellen Wolter:That's Libby Stegger, founder of Civic Bridgers, a Minnesota organization that works to prepare young leaders to bridge divides. And Angelina Rueta and Samaya Yassin, who participated in Civic Bridger's campus bridging initiative, a rural urban exchange program for college students. In Side by Side's final episode for season two, I talk with Libby about her organization and what it looks and feels like in practice to bridge, to be a bridger, and to provide bridging skills to young leaders. Libby sees bridging as foundational for democracy. She explains that we need an informal bridging network and infrastructure across rural and urban spaces, just like we need a physical bridging infrastructure to connect us.
Ellen Wolter:And Angelina and Samaya share what they learned in this program and how connecting with people who have different ideas from them and who are from different places than them has provided a greater understanding for why connection across difference and place is so important. Even when conversations might be hard and uncertain and uncomfortable, they learn skills to break down barriers and assumptions and, as Samaya shared, to see each other as people. And the end result was seeing that folks wherever they are from have the same needs for safety, belonging, and opportunity. Is Ellen Wolter from the University of Minnesota Extension, and welcome to the Side by Side podcast. Well, welcome Civic Bridgers.
Ellen Wolter:We are so happy to have you here today.
Libby Stegger:Thank you for having us.
Ellen Wolter:We've got Libby, Samaya and Angelina, all here to share with us about their experience either leading Civic Bridgers or participating in programs that Civic Bridgers provides. Libby, I'm going to start with you. Can you tell us a little bit about Civic Bridgers?
Libby Stegger:Absolutely. Civic Bridgers is a nonprofit, and our mission is to strengthen American democracy by preparing emerging leaders to bridge divides. So what does that mean? It means that we offer programming for emerging leaders starting as young as 14 and going up from there to build the muscle and get the experience of bridging divides. And for us, that means bringing people back into civic life and civic engagement in ways that reconnect people to each other.
Libby Stegger:And so our programs are really designed for people to not only build their skills in bridging divides, but also to get practical experience in doing that, because we know that that practice, that muscle, that taking action in our community is a big piece of what bridging is, and to do that in ways that bring people together across differences. So that is what we do. I'm really excited to be here today with you, Ellen, as you are bringing people together across differences and also with Angelina and Samaya, who recently participated in our campus bridging initiative, which I know we'll have a minute to talk about down the line.
Ellen Wolter:What was the need that you really saw in communities where this muscle of civic engagement and connecting with each other needed to be strengthened?
Libby Stegger:Yeah, so many of us in America right now and in Minnesota in particular are feeling this strain of division. That sometimes we talk about that in terms of red blue, but it really is becoming a culture of division where it's increasingly difficult to solve challenges. It's increasingly difficult for us to find common ground on anything. We're increasingly distrustful of each other in society as well as in our institutions. And when those things happen, then we withdraw from engagement.
Libby Stegger:And when we withdraw from engagement, it increasingly builds up that distrust. And so I actually was experiencing that in my own life, in my own work, and seeing problems that I really wanted to get involved in or wanted to be a part of solving alongside other people who really cared passionately about community life, we were increasingly unable to solve those challenges because of divisions that we are experiencing. So I said, Well, someone's got to do something about that. I started looking around being like, Who's doing something about that and how can we do it? What I found was a lot of really great initiatives that are building dialogue.
Libby Stegger:They're dialogue based initiatives that help people build more understanding. There were a lot of really great initiatives that were working on strengthening institutions or increasing voter turnout. What I didn't find was the cross section between that, the cross section of taking action and doing that in ways that build understanding. And so thus was born Civic Bridgers, which started with our fellowship program, A Year of National Service, where people are taking action in communities, working with nonprofits and public agencies for twelve months full time, and that is our fellowship program. And it has since grown to include our college programs and our teen programs.
Ellen Wolter:Tell me about the campus bridging initiative. One of the reasons I was really interested in talking with all of you is that it's a campus bridging initiative that focuses on bridging across rural and urban, which is of course the focus of this podcast. So I'm really interested in that focus on rural and urban and what you were hoping to accomplish with starting this particular initiative.
Libby Stegger:This initiative was born from the learning that we have from people who are in our programs and in our orbit. Hearing from folks who felt like there really wasn't a lot of understanding between urban and rural communities is one of our biggest gaps. And part of that is geography. Like if we are physically not in spaces together, we often don't have the opportunity to learn about each other, to experience each other. And that kind of learning is what helps reduce stereotypes.
Libby Stegger:And the urban and rural stereotypes are among some of the last sort of, what I would say, are unfortunately somehow socially acceptable ways of stereotyping, and it was something that we wanted to do something about. So we were hearing from young people who were in our programs that there were things that were being said or experiences that they were having, where people were turning a blind eye to those kinds of stereotypes. And so we thought, okay, well, what's our role in doing this? How do we take the content that we know, the thing that we do best, which is building understanding through immersive experiences and then taking action on it? What would that look like on college campuses?
Libby Stegger:And so thus was born the campus bridging initiative. And the idea is that students are coming together from both urban and rural backgrounds, they spend four full days together. So Angelina was part of one program that was four full days over spring break, and Samaya was part of one that was two separate weekends at different college campuses. And they're spending that time together. So it's the time that they're spending together.
Libby Stegger:They're doing workshop based skill building around their bridging skills and how to take action in civic life. And then also, let's not call them field trips, but experiences out in the community where they're meeting civic leaders, they're visiting civic spaces, they're visiting common shared spaces, and exploring both the differences and the similarities between those spaces and thinking together, how do we take care of these common spaces? How do we invest in them so that we can create plurality of ideas and spaces where we can be together across differences? So that was the idea of the Campus Bridging Initiative, but these two helped bring it to life.
Ellen Wolter:Angelina, why don't we start with you? Where is home for you? Do you consider yourself a rural person, a suburban person, or an urban person in terms of your background? And then what drew you to participate in this initiative?
Angelina Rueda:I'm kind of a mixed background girl now. I've had the privilege of living in all settings. So I grew up in inner city Milwaukee, so that was very houses stacked on top of each other, very neighborhood feel. And then I've also lived in the suburbs outside of Milwaukee, which again, houses are a little bit farther apart, but definitely there is business and there's like just a lot still going on. And then now I've had the privilege of living in Winona for the last five years, which is pretty rural and definitely my favorite of them, which a lot of people don't expect.
Angelina Rueda:But having that experience within all and seeing my own differences with all of that and having to unlearn my own biases really led me to looking at civic life in different ways. And then the CBI program came across my LinkedIn actually, and I was like, This is perfect. And something I never thought about too deeply. And so having the chance for a week to really think about that and now having built on that for the last few months post program, I think it is really important, especially because Minnesota is so city centered with everything else around it, that if we're not all involving, people aren't going to get left out and voices aren't going get heard. Especially my home, Wynonna, where I love, and I think has a lot going on and we have a lot to learn from the cities and people a lot to learn from us.
Ellen Wolter:What about you, Samaya? Do you consider yourself a rural urban, a suburban person in terms of your background and what led you to want to participate in this work?
Sumaya Yassin:So, home would be the suburbs. I've lived in the suburbs majority of my life, but, I'm currently in St. Paul, I've been living in St. Paul. So a little bit of both, so I get to kind of see both sides.
Sumaya Yassin:I joined Civic Bridgers because like Angelina, I had my own assumptions of what a rural area would be like and which weren't the most positive assumptions. And so I wanted to learn a little bit more, like get firsthand experience from people and hear about what is your life like. And that kind of drew me to this campus initiative.
Ellen Wolter:What assumptions or myths, if you will, were kind of busted for you and you were like, oh, I didn't really realize that. That's kind of a surprise.
Sumaya Yassin:So for me personally, I think just coming in with that, like, oh, the urban area is so scary. People are very scary all around. And then I kinda met people and then started talking to people. And with Civic Bridgers, they structure it so that you first have the opportunity to talk about who you are as a person and say, okay, this is my culture. And we break it down so it's more digestible and have those conversations of like, who am I?
Sumaya Yassin:And then you kinda see the similarities like, oh, that's kinda similar to my culture and then your culture. And then we come together and we're slowly starting to see eye to eye and start seeing each other as people and not, oh, like, you are this person that, you know, is from a scary town. And and then being able to meet people who talk about how their community is very tight knit in a cute, like, fun, cozy way and not, oh, like, this is scary. And it breaks down these barriers of, oh, we aren't so different. And then as the program went, we would be able to see, like, the so it was, like, Benny's who live in the rural area came to St.
Sumaya Yassin:Kate's and then Katie's came to St. Ben's. And so they kind of got familiar and comfortable and then we got really close and created something so beautiful.
Ellen Wolter:So Samaya, when you're talking about assumptions about urban areas, was that your experience coming from a suburban place that you were a little nervous about going to an urban space and worried about how it might be scary or a crime? And then you realized, oh, this is just, you know, a neighborhood that feels cozy and tight knit. Do I have that right?
Sumaya Yassin:Yes, absolutely. I think the suburb is a good mix between rural and urban, but you do come in with like, oh, everyone is probably not gonna like someone like a person of color. So I was I definitely was a little scared. And then to see that, oh, like, there are people of color there, which is a little silly, but, and then there's also people who have a community and it's kind of like their own little city.
Ellen Wolter:Yeah. That was absolutely my experience living in Minneapolis. It was like
Sumaya Yassin:my little small town in my
Ellen Wolter:little neighborhood. That's how it felt to me. And coming from a small town, I just did not expect that at all. What about you, Angelina?
Angelina Rueda:I think for me, the biggest thing with transitioning from living in Milwaukee, which is a very diverse, very booming place in a lot of regards. There's always a lot going on, both good and bad. But I was also a kid and I think that was different for me because my parents weren't super involved in the local community. And so I never felt that neighborhood community feel. And then once I got into Winona, I really was able to step off that campus and into the rural life in a way.
Angelina Rueda:And I did think the lack of minorities in Winona, which is just a simple fact of who lives there, would take a lot more of a toll on me. But everyone there is so accepting and the town has now grown. We just opened a Mexican grocery store last week, but to see that growth in the town and for the town to be so excited about, like that is not something that I conceived before. But also, think with rural urban, one of my biggest things that I disconstructed was making it synonymous with conservative liberal, which obviously already adds a polarizing aspect to it. And so for me, this town, although there is a large conservative and a large liberal base in it, it just feels like a community no matter where.
Angelina Rueda:I think a large degree to that is that the town is so small that if you don't get along, there's not really much else, there's nowhere else to go. So they had to make pockets for everyone to exist, because if not, there wouldn't be as many pockets simply. So I really enjoyed that aspect of getting to know the town on such deeper roots that's not political, which then helped me transcend into a more political sphere because now I'm understanding it on a basis that's not black and white conservative liberal, but can we move this in Winona to make it good for everyone? And then Civic Bridgers came in and showed me that that's just bridging work right there within the community.
Ellen Wolter:Libby, how does the bridging initiative, how do you think it helps students learn about each other? What are the aspects of this program that really helps folks kind of dig into getting past the stereotypes and the assumptions?
Libby Stegger:So the three main components of the campus bridging initiative are skill building, right? So we do some workshops together. They are very inquiry based, dialogue based workshops. And that's when Samaya and Angelina and their peers who are in the group got to talk about what they think actually debunk stereotypes and myths, experienced that together and really plumb those depths. And so Samaya talked about one of the first exercises that they do are about sharing who they are and then hearing from their peers about something that's within their own culture.
Libby Stegger:Because bridging is not becoming one. It is not about coming to the middle. It is about standing in who we are and respecting who the other person is. And so it starts by that getting to know each other. The second part is really the local visits.
Libby Stegger:And so we went to community common spaces as we call them. So these are open public spaces where people can literally rub shoulders together right there, parks, there are museums. They are sometimes dining places together, right? We went in St. Joseph's, went to the house where people, all different kinds of restaurants and people can come together.
Libby Stegger:So these are both private businesses, public spaces. We went to the capital, right? But as a way to see what a civic infrastructure look like in places where pluralism is thriving. And the idea of pluralism being where multiple perspectives, experiences, individuals can come together. So that was the second piece of it, like actually get out in the community and feel experience it, see it, talk to people, meet with local leaders, and get to know the place where you are.
Libby Stegger:And the third piece of it was honestly, we don't want to overlook it, is being together. So this is designed to be immersed as four full days. They're spending the night in hotels or on campus, and they get to go for walks with each other or like the Katie's did a tour for the Bennies who came to visit, the tour of campus. Just time to be together. We can't diminish that because in a really busy world that is increasingly atomized, we are coming in, we have agendas, we do our thing, and then we leave.
Libby Stegger:And we lose that organic connection and the time and space when we can connect on something a little bit deeper.
Ellen Wolter:Angelina and Samaya, do you have a highlight from the program that sticks with you? And Angelina, I'll start with you.
Angelina Rueda:Something that has really, really stuck with me because it is important to be really active in your local community, but also understand that your local community might extend up to that state level. Now I understand that although I have such a beautiful life going in Manila, there is so much going on in the cities that I can learn from, and there's so much going on in Manila that we can learn from, but it's also important to connect the two and make sure that we're on the same page and that we're going in a direction together. But I think on a more personal, this touched me directly in my heart was there's this guy there from New York, and he was a very, very smart, very confident, very outspoken individual. And even though we were very much theoretically on the same page, when it came down to the nitty gritty, we found ourselves getting stuck in these little arguments of like, What do we mean by this? So that was a really cool experience where I'd get out of my ego and understand that people just live a different life than me.
Angelina Rueda:And that's okay, especially when they live in such a different place. But that was like something that's also stuck with me, like listening, hearing and then understanding.
Ellen Wolter:Angelina, how do you think that has helped you in your work, in your life? Just thinking about like, Oh, well, this person just thinks differently than me. How does that add value to the work that you do?
Angelina Rueda:It's honestly added a lot of value to me because it helped me reevaluate how I go about people that aren't on the same page as me politically. Because I understand that the world is so different that these labels realistically don't mean much anymore. They're just labels to separate ourselves. Even in my in group, I was having those issues. So it's clearly not a group alliance issue.
Angelina Rueda:It's just that I think people just don't take the time understand and really listen without that anger first. And it's really hard to get rid of that ego. And so with working with populations that aren't going to be on the same side of me, Winona does have a large conservative base. They have a large rural base that grew up in a life that I didn't grow up in, even though I love enjoying it now. And so it really just taught me that you can find difference and similarities anywhere, and you just have to be willing to have that curiosity to look at them.
Angelina Rueda:Because again, this wasn't really even an urban rural liberal conservative issue, was an issue on listening. And I think that's overall what I learned is that we're just not listening to each other in empathetic ways. And so I'm really excited to bridge that and start showing people that there is similarities and differences with all of us.
Ellen Wolter:What about you, Samaya? What were some of the highlights for you and things that stuck with you after the program?
Sumaya Yassin:So at St. Ben's, we had a couple workshops, and a workshop that really stuck with me was when we watched this video about comedians and them using, like, humor to kinda navigate, like, political tensions. And I think it was really interesting to me because everyone has been kind of saying these are really difficult conversations to have. And typically when you hold a value really close to you, it's really hard to not get defensive about it. So kind of using like that humor to just dismantle that hard conversation and not be like, like Angelina just said, to not have a conversation and be angry and just kinda be like, okay.
Sumaya Yassin:We all see what's kind of going on, and let's just make light of it so that we can be able to have this conversation and to be able to take the conversation and go further with it. So to make it make action with it. And this whole program kinda showed where it's okay. We're having this conversation, but also what can we do afterwards? And how do we take these conversations further.
Libby Stegger:It's such a good reminder too that joy is a bridger, that when we can celebrate together and have fun together, that there is a lot of connection that can be built there as well. And it doesn't all have to feel hard and serious all the time.
Ellen Wolter:We can also have a good laugh. What is one thing that and this is for all of you. Libby, this is for you, too. What is one thing that you want people to better understand about where you're from, I guess, wherever you consider home now, and how it might connect to the rest of the region?
Angelina Rueda:I think about this one quite a bit, but not even just consequences, but the idea of in our sessions, we were very lucky to learn from Harry Maury. Harry Boy and Maury Strom. Harry Boy and Maury Strom. And they are wonderful individuals, taught us a lot. But Harry went on this, he gave us a lesson about this idea of knowledge on tap, not on top.
Angelina Rueda:And I think one thing that I really learned from also Katie from Civic Bridgers was that within rural towns, there's a lot of knowledge that's not accredited because it's not from a university level. And then within cities, you obviously have this academia level, but then is that getting out to the greater public? So with this community learning and this actual physical being together and these bridging divides, you are naturally going to learn so much And you're going to create networks that will lead you to know so much so you're not reinventing the wheel every time. You're able to understand where other people are coming from. That's not from a place of like, I'm sitting in school studying this, but I am creating a genuine relationship with you.
Angelina Rueda:And now I understand you on such a much deeper level. And so this idea of being able to spread that around, I think we'll also be spreading that knowledge around and getting that knowledge to be on top and not on top. So that was a really great lesson that I learned that I think transcends all the divides.
Sumaya Yassin:I think for me, both communities, like, have these core values where it's desire for safety, belonging, and opportunity. And that understanding that it's not just an urban thing or it's not just a rural thing where everybody has these core values, and it's where they derive from. So, again, like, at Saint Kate's where the Bennies came and eventually started feeling at home there, It just kind of, like, helps us connect as a whole where it's like, okay. Everyone wants safety and they wanna feel included and they want this opportunity. And I I think it just kind of helps me understand both sides or understands that's a core or how I see as a core similarity between the two groups.
Ellen Wolter:What about you, Libby?
Libby Stegger:Smaya, I love that this desire for safety, belonging, and opportunity because Ellen, your question makes me think about where I live. I live in St. Paul, Minnesota, and it is my adopted home. They've adopted me. I did not grow up there and didn't know a lot about St.
Libby Stegger:Paul before I moved in. And the place where I live has this beautiful neighborhood feel. We have this exercise in the Campus Bridging Initiative where we share a story, a visual story, of something that we care about in our place. And what always calls to mind for me is just this experience of coming home at the end of the day, and my neighbors have chairs out on the sidewalk and are talking together and the kids are running around and playing. There are other neighbors who we may or may not know who might walk by with a dog or just to pop out and take out the trash, but it is vibrant and interactive.
Libby Stegger:And it's different than what I experienced growing up in the suburbs on a little cul de sac where it was quieter. That had its charm, and this feels different. And so that's what I want people to know about my home. And I want people from my place to know that kind of experience does exist elsewhere too in rural spaces, in urban spaces, that people, to Sanaya's point, people are seeking safety, belonging, and opportunity in all their spaces, and that a diversity of people and ideas exists in rural spaces too. And I think there's a narrative, a dominant narrative where I live, but that's not true.
Libby Stegger:And so I want to push people to see beyond that and to see that there are meaningful differences and we need to acknowledge those and hear those. And we have so much more in common than we're led to believe.
Ellen Wolter:So Maya and Angelina, what are some of the ways that this program may be influenced how you think about your future and where you might live and work and play or the things that you might want to do for a career? And, Angeline, I'll start with you.
Angelina Rueda:Yeah, I mean, I always had an inkling that I would get into nonprofit community work, but I always saw that as like going about in a way of poverty de escalation, something in that regard, which is something I care about, but I've always held politics very close to me. I think growing up as a Hispanic woman, where my first election I really saw was the twenty sixteen one, really made me aware of how polarized this country was. And I will admit, I added to that as a teenager. I fully added to that. And this CBI program really allowed me to understand where I would be most impactful based on my experiences, because it felt like this program came about at a time in my life where I felt that there really was a need for something.
Angelina Rueda:And I really was understanding what that was because I was almost feeling like a bridger in my own regard with having lived in Milwaukee and then moving to Winona and experiencing such different things, but loving it, which was very surprising. And then to now have it labeled and to now have a path where now I'm continuing to work with civic bridgers, I will be doing a fellowship with AmeriCorps directly targeting at bridging these divides. I'll be still in the room working with a lot of people who are in Minneapolis working at these nonprofits. And I'm just really excited that connected network is now something that I have direct access to. So I feel very thankful to the Civic Bridges for that.
Angelina Rueda:But I do see myself continuing community work and adding to depolarization of our culture because as a sociology major as well, I see how culture shapes the everyday aspects of our life. And I'm really excited to now have these things labeled for me. I'm excited to have this path put in front of me. Again, these networks that set of bridges have been so gracious to allow me to join.
Ellen Wolter:You keep talking about networks and that is so true. You're building social capital across difference. Right? Social capital is very undervalued in our society. But as you continue to have people participating in this program, think about that network that you're building.
Ellen Wolter:But what about you, Samaya?
Sumaya Yassin:This program has taught me, like, how to approach a conversation with openness and not defensiveness. Again, kind of like what we've all been talking about where we want to have these important conversations, but to be able to have it, you must take the approach of understanding this person and seeing them at a different level. And I'm still in college, and I'm looking at all the potential ways that I can make a change within the world and being exposed to these type of conversations and potentially seeing, oh, like, I can take I can take action and I can see myself applying things that I've learned within this short program into hopefully something larger. So I also got to hear about specific people who got to launch these cool programs within their own personal communities that grew so large and really had an impact on all sorts of people. So I think taking those stories with me and hopefully being able to do that same type of work.
Libby Stegger:These young women are right on point with what we're hoping to achieve, right? We see our work as, yes, building those networks. We are intentional about building a web because we can't do this alone. Democracy work, bridging work requires that collective muscle in each of us participating, and so it requires a web. And so Angelina, you mean that beautifully.
Libby Stegger:And it requires us, we call ourselves civic bridgers as an organization, but it's also an identity that we hold. When we can share an identity that is about being a civic bridger, while we might not agree on a lot of things, we might disagree deeply on many, many things, but we can agree on the value of pluralism, on the value that other people's perspectives have value even when, and especially when we disagree. And when that is our common ground that we start from, we actually start from a really different kind of conversation. And to Sumayya's point, there are so many people in the world, some people are giving, it's their life's work, they're in nonprofits or they're in public service, who are building incredible things. And civic engagement and bridging does not have to be your life's work in order to be part of your life.
Libby Stegger:We met with lots of folks who were running their businesses or participating in the community, their neighbors in the community, or they're working at the college, but who are finding ways to build their strengths. Samaya and some of her peers, they're working in healthcare fields. That absolutely has a role for civic life there. And so what I want people to hear and what I'm so grateful that these two have taken away from it is that being a civic bridger is for everyone. You can make it your life and you can make it a piece of your life.
Libby Stegger:So we need everyone.
Ellen Wolter:We need everyone. Yeah. I'm sure you're all familiar with folks who say bridging, their concerns about bridging are that it maybe glosses over power imbalances, right? Or structural inequities in our society, or it may put marginalized communities in spaces where they might not feel safe psychologically or may not have their voices heard. And so I wonder, what are some of the ways that you navigate that tension of outbridging?
Libby Stegger:I'll jump in first. Thank you for asking the question. It's so important. And what I share with all of our participants is that we get to build our own tent. And so there are places and spaces that are harmful for folks that can be psychologically and sometimes physically dangerous for people.
Libby Stegger:I think sometimes we assume that a place will be like that when it's not. So I encourage people to question that bias. But it's true, and so we can't ignore that. So we get to choose the tent that we are in. And I encourage people to just push a little bit beyond where they feel their comfort.
Libby Stegger:But we get to decide sort of when we're feeling like we can bridge and when we can't when it's too much, right? So this isn't to say everyone needs to be talking to everyone at all times and putting yourself in harm's way. We get to choose. And when we are together, let's start from that place of understanding who we are as individuals. Let's understand our values.
Libby Stegger:But if we're seeing bridging that is the things that you described, Ellen, that is it ends up being passive or it wipes over the ugly parts or it perpetuates power imbalances, that's not bridging to me. That sounds like tokenization or it sounds like performative dialogue. When we see bridging and when it's done well, it does have dialogue. It has respectful dialogue. I encourage people to, if there are power imbalances in the room, go to the place where the people who may have the least amount of power feel the least amount of power feel comfortable, right?
Libby Stegger:So it's like go into each other's spaces when we are invited so that there are ways that we can listen more deeply and be outside of our comfort zone. If we are traditionally the ones who are in a place of comfort, let's get outside of our comfort zone. And so there are ways for us to create structures that help us bridge. But if we choose not to bridge consistently, we will continue to be in a space of lack of understanding. And so we don't have a choice in some ways.
Libby Stegger:We're all here and we're not going anywhere. And so in order for us to address those power imbalances and to really hear each other deeply and to actually make changes that will be good for everyone, that will help everyone thrive, we actually have to find ways to bridge. We have to find ways to understanding so that we can collaborate, that the changes that we make in our society stick.
Angelina Rueda:Yeah, I think both of me and Somaya being part of some marginalized communities, I think bridging has been very powerful for me. Again, I talked about growing up in this era of polarization where as a Hispanic woman, I felt like a lot of my personal character was being attacked by people I did not know and I do not know. So it's been really awesome to able to sit down and really understand where is that coming from, why is that here, and how can I make sure that my story is heard in a way that makes me feel a part of this American culture, a part of this? And I think bridging is a way to get power back. And so when you're talking about these power imbalances, the only way to fix that is to have this open facilitation of how can we get to a place where these do not exist anymore?
Angelina Rueda:How can we come together? Because at the end the day, we're all Americans, we're all civic bridgers, we're all part of this democracy, and it doesn't work well if we've allocated ourselves into these fences. So I think for me, although I recognize that it's hard, it's mentally draining, sometimes I do feel like a little unsafe, especially when I'm in areas where I don't know if there's many other people that look and have the same experience as me. But I found that that discomfort has eased greatly in the last two years of me actively getting outside that bubble. And I also think people online are a lot quicker to snap at you than when you actually are face to face understanding and creating a dialogue that has space for questions, has space for wrongness.
Angelina Rueda:Sometimes people aren't gonna get it right right away. They're going to use language to describe you and use notions to describe you that doesn't describe you or your culture. But the only way to fix that is to educate in a way that doesn't humiliate or dehumanize or create an era of separation. Instead, bridging allows us to come together in a way to fix these problems that polarization would never allow you to.
Ellen Wolter:What kinds of recommendations or advice would you give to community leaders and institutions for how to be better bridgers?
Libby Stegger:It starts with listening. It starts with getting really curious. It starts with creating meaningful, trusted allies who can help you see a different perspective. So let's use urban and rural as an example. I live in St.
Libby Stegger:Paul, it's a city, I lived there for over a decade, It's home. I don't spend that much time in rural spaces, or I didn't before I started this organization. And so it was really important to me to have that perspective, to be able to understand that. And so I started out by building relationships with a couple of people who lived and loved rural spaces who could help me understand things differently. And so when something comes up and I'm like, I don't understand, I don't get what's going on, I can pick up the phone and I can ask, or I can say, Can I come out and see what this is like for you?
Libby Stegger:So having some of those and being curious, it's not the end. That's not the goal. It is a beginning. But it is a way to say, How can I begin to understand better? And start to do that in trusted spaces where I can ask the question that I might not really want to ask in front of a big room, or where I shouldn't be, but where I can be building those things.
Libby Stegger:So I think for leaders, if you can identify, Okay, what's a place where I need to build a bridge? Maybe that's urban rural, maybe it's race based, maybe it's age based. There could be generational differences. And there are lots of places where we need to build those bridges. But think about the ones that are getting in the way of you being effective, the most effective leader you can be in your community.
Libby Stegger:And then find some allies, some folks who you can build relationships with, authentic, trusting relationships where you're not just extracting. Build those relationships and cultivate them because they are windows and they can help us become the bridge. And so we need to cultivate it. It's invaluable. Especially in a world where we're behind our devices and inside our homes, we can become disconnected so easily.
Libby Stegger:So we have to remember that connection. And I see it I have hope because I do see that shifting and I see increasingly people coming outside of their little spaces and into community. The opportunities for us to learn from each other are abundant, and we are missing them by not knowing each other, by not seeing those interdependencies. And I constantly have to remind myself, as well as the people around me, that hope is not a feeling, it's an action. And I started this work because I was losing hope.
Libby Stegger:And I have four young children and a community and a country that I care about deeply, and losing hope wasn't a choice that I felt like I had. The only thing we can do is act. And so when I started doing that, when I started taking action on this issue, I met incredible young leaders like Samaya, like Angelina, and they help fill my cup of hope. And so the action leads to hope. So hope is an action.
Ellen Wolter:I love that Libby. Hope is an action. And you are all giving me an incredible amount of hope today. I really appreciate you taking the time and sharing your experience. And so thank you so much.
Libby Stegger:Thank you, Ellen.
Ellen Wolter:Thank you for listening to Side by Side. We welcome your emails at sidebysideumn dot edu. Side by Side is a production of the University of Minnesota Extension and is written and hosted by me, Ellen Wolter. Special thanks to Jan Jekula, who designed our wonderful logo, and Jim Griswold, who sings and plays guitar in our opening and closing credits. You can find episodes of Side by Side wherever you get your podcasts.
Ellen Wolter:I'm Ellen Walter, and this is side by side.
